-
Website
http://www.thinkchristian.net/ -
Original page
http://www.thinkchristian.net/index.php/2009/04/29/why-people-leave-the-church/ -
Subscribe
All Comments -
Community
-
-
Top Commenters
-
Popular Threads
All Comments
Where an individual church may depart the Word, I can see departing the premises.
Those who depart Christ utterly may not have understood the meaning of life in the first place.
The issue is that people and not pastors make the congregation. If the pastor is the only one keeping together the "faithful" and not everyones responsibility the the church will and has failed. It is more of a congregant issue then pastoral.
People have become as a rule less interested with genuine pietistic living and have turned towards social club Christianity. They desire nothing but connectedness. Just look at the ink spilled about the subject regarding unity and togetherness.
If all we did was focus on genuine personal revival and not "acting" like the church I know that the church would function better. The church has given out the rule book and it looks a lot like a social ethical book that will make us a better church/business entity.
Yes I am disenfranchised. I am tired of the church and I want out, but I am also a believer and know that i am supposed to submit, but sometimes I feel like I am submitting to a wet sponge.
I need a church experience with people who are not all exactly like me; who do not all think exactly like me; who do not have the same economic status as me; who do not read the same things I read; listen to the same music I listen to (demand the same worship experience I do).
I need a church that demands something of me - a church worthy of Jesus giving his life for; a church that is destined to be the spotless bride of Christ. And that same spotless bride, the New Jerusalem is the same church that infuriates us with its hypocrisy and inner conflicts and lack of compassion and sin and all the rest. But it is still the church.
Discipleship isn't this idea that we struggle to get along, it is about teaching and growing. It is about surrendering together, so that we can do Matthew 28 all over again.
The Church is supposed to be a movement of people that are moving towards righteousness, not about the struggle to get along.
The first century church was not a bunch of isolate islands of disciples all struggling on their own toward righteousness. It was a mix of large group/small group, beautiful/ugly - getting it, not getting it, movement sometimes (usually?) in the right direction.
The church getting it and doing it, by the way, is not a matter of "them" it is "us" - do I get it? Do I do it (whatever it is)?
I don't think that it is that easy. Maybe I am pessimistic, but I believe that there are very few churches out there that actually care more about the people then about the financial and social aspect of churches. It is how we have such flaky authors that produce "TOP SELLERS" with crap. I could name a few, but you know who they are. The church is in fact looking for genuine faith, that is why I believe that many are leaving and heading to Catholic church. There is a tradition and a reverence that is there that many other churches have lost. I don't believe that People leave Protestantism because they don't believe anymore, I think that they know that there is more too it then what we hear at the local church.
There is accountability. There is right/wrong! There is an ethical and moral stance in politics.
These things said I believe that maybe the answer comes in small home groups of 10 or 15 people. Together studying the word of God, but how do you keep out error? Well in the first century they had Apostles who were traveling "pastor" who would attend different meetings and help with issues of incorrect doctrine. We don't even have that accountability in the CRC. Accountability is the key to success within the body of Christ.
There is a constant need to keep us accountable. I think that all churches with significant overhead will forget at one point or another the need to be for the people and not for the Payroll.
I had a Pastor who said if U drink wine U cannot be on the church board, a deacon basically. The process was by vote and nomination. I was nominated and the pastor asked me if I had a problem with being on the board. I said I did not but that U do. I told him I enjoy wine once in awhile and informed him his position was not scriptural. I also asked him if he was willing to stand on his non scriptural positin? He said yes. I then told him Jesus nor anyone in the Bible could not qualify to be on his board. He did not care. I have heard pastors demanding God heal someone. Command the harvest to come. Say everyone should drive a Mercedes or Rolls Royce. It goes on and on. I still go to church for the fellowship of believers.
I could never be on a church board. I would leave the Church in an instant.
The big issues that become problems in the church are not because of buildings or because of structure or because of funding. Those are simply ways in which the problems find expression. The problems are essentially the same today as they ever have been: we fail to live lives empowered by the Holy Spirit to live in the kind of loving community that Jesus said would be the indication to the rest of the world that we belong to him.
The form these bodies take and the buildings they take them in is of little importance. What is of far more importance is the attitudes of superiority we maintain as we isolate ourselves from those who don't see the church the way we do.
The people I have deep sympathy for in this whole thing are those who are on the fringe because of deep hurts caused by church people who have abused them or used them for their own religious ends. They have been conditioned, in a sense, to reject a church that is not the church Christ intended. Although, it should also be said that there is a sense in which the imperfections of the church is exactly the church he intended because he intended that we would have to "BEAR WITH ONE ANOTHER" - if the church was perfect, there would be no need to bear with - we would enjoy every moment of our time together, whether in homes or stadiums, or lecture halls, or temple courts.
Imagine living in the book of Acts and living around the early believers who shared everything in common. All there needs were physical and spiritual needs being met. Would U want to become part of that? The living Bible. How about today? If U had a home church like that, and the word got out in the hood, what would happen? Huge natural expansion. There R 104 churches within 8 miles of my home in Palm Harbor Fl. If half of those love flowed out as it did in the Acts Church what do U think would happen? More love, less poverty, less crime, more people in the kingdom. The Apostle were 12 guy's who changed the world. No degrees, no church buildings, or private jets, American express cards. There R big churches who cannot change a city block. We R admonished to take care of the widows and the orphans. There R orphanages in the Tampa bay area. There should not be. I went to the leadership of a 2500 person church and had an idea. There was a low income area close to the church. I thought as the church sat empty most of the week why not bring the people in and train them to get jobs and how to keep them by teaching them skills. I was told by leadership that there was no return on their investment. How is that for love?
At one point in my life, all of that lead to me thinking I can just do this on my own. It's all about the relationship I have with Christ, not the church building. This is what I would tell myself.
Looking back, those are some of the times I was furthest from God in my lifestyle. I temporarily joined that 71% that was just sort of drifting away.
I've been blessed lately with going to church full of people who are trying to live Christian lives the best they can. Plus the teaching is solid, Bible based stuff. Not fluff.
Obviously I now think the church is a crucial part of my spiritual growth. I think our challenge is to be serving at churches to help them be a place where we realize none of us are perfect, but together we can try to live better and serve in the way Jesus calls us to. I think when the church looks more like that, we'll see less folks becoming drifters.
But my question is, how does the church better enfold those who are drifting out to the edges and beyond?
And let me flip the question around: how are those who are on the edges called to engage the community of faith and let people minister to them?
"I think our challenge is to be serving at churches to help them be a place where we realize none of us are perfect, but together we can try to live better and serve in the way Jesus calls us to"
i like this very much. thanks.
here's my opinion. the study showed the main reason why people leave church...judgmental and hypocritical people, too many and too much about rules and; the church is power-hungry and money-crazed. the key word i think is "serving". as jerod mentioned. as this thread obviously shows, there is much to criticize about organizations, people and teachings. but what steven is pointing out is that how can we serve in a way that reaches those in the fringes. those that are drifting away. there is little we can do about the reality of church politics and the many defects of structure. but i think we should focus on our calling to be the called out ones, the ones that decalare His excellencies, and not wait around to be "ministered to" .
perhaps we can start by toning down our hypercritical attitude towards those in leadership. many elders, deacons and pastors would love to just sit around in houses sipping coffee and do inductive bible study. but God called them to this very thankless office. and there a few who are sincerely striving to be faithful undershepherds. lets pray for them, that the Lord would not let power or money get in the way of their calling as leaders.
i also see a new legalism rising.... emerging. a legalism where there are no rules. no guidelines. no order and eventually...no scripture. just a group of people getting along fine...without Jesus. we fight against too many rules. i agree with this 100%. but the Spirit is also the God of order. i think the key to serving is accountability. it is not so easy to rant in a blog when you have made a commitment to a congregation, no matter how imperfect it is. because, well, it is all about grace isn't it?
If you're connected to the Head, you won't be able to stay from the body for long. Are you part of the problem or part of the solution? I know I was THE problem for a long time before I got serious about what Jesus died for- His Bride-the Church.
But Jesus didn't die for the church as an organizational event or even as a relational event, but rather for salvation. Getting along great is just a different issue, one which I don't disagree is important side issue, but not the main issue.
We are so concerned with keeping our own issues that we don't spend the time or money to minister to the population at large. We are sending less missionaries then ever. We are supporting less missionaries then ever. I belonged to a church once where their multi-million dollar budget included $5,000 for missions and over $500,000 in multimedia... Seems a bit backwards, but moving on.
Your assumption is that it is the Body of Christ. How can you tell? By the fruit? Or are we not supposed to judge? Well that puts us into a pickle doesn't it.
Alvin,
That new sense of legalism you are talking about is call "UN Regenerate" or "Non-Christian" I wouldn't argue with them if I had too. You can not tell a fool his folly, or you will be made the fool.
We try to justify that there are other tenants that make up Christianity like believing, however James points out that if there are no fruits your "faith" is suspect.
Depending on one's particular role and the size of the church this balance will be met in different ways. I believe that it is most important that neither gets lost and that there is a component of both in any role within the church.
if people don't agree move to were they will.
As if the divisions among believers is not bad enough (thousands of denominations - almost as many churches as law firms in any given town), we further condemn ourselves by running from one church to the next at the slightest provocation - or even worse, we run away altogether.
I see three solid biblical reasons to leave a church: 1. biblical error that the leadership refuses to correct; 2. gross immorality that the leadership refuses to address; 3. calling to ministry that requires a change in location or at least in fellowship. Otherwise, we should find a way to heal what is broken.
That, of course, is ideal and we don't live in an ideal world. But if we would at least strive for it, we would see something more like the church the early Christians had where they didn't have several dozen churches to choose from in one town, and the idea of leaving the church, for a believer, would have been unthinkable - as long as one remained a believer.
We have asked for help, but our one child's needs are so intense, that there is no one who feels they even can help. We do home church by watching a broadcast on TV and discussing it afterwards - application. But it's lonely.
Perhaps it is a matter of trying to appeal to the whirlwind of the North American culture that is bringing in politics, or trying to keep them out. Not really sure. Sometimes I think it's just that we get so busy, we get distracted by 'shiny things' and when we look back to our congregations, we feel discontented. Other congregations require an application, interview, fill in a booklet, and get approved to just become a member because they are so busy being the 'corporate body'.
Sometimes I wonder if we've lost our first love. If in this over stimulating and fast-paced world we live in, Jesus just doesn't seem enough. After learning about Christ through the eyes of the disabled, it really allows me to see this world differently too. Maybe being caught up in the need to 'grow', we've forgotten why we are alive in the first place? JMHO, but then again, maybe I've just got too much grass growing under my feet!!!
How to change it? Connect. It takes time and may mean that you don't grow at the rapid pace and several thousand in attendance, but those relationships are real and a family base does indeed form. Be truly concerned and loving towards your church family. Go beyond the hugs and handshakes at the door. Use various social technologies, but always bring it back to the human connection and relationship, modeling relationship building of God, with our family in Christ.
Just glad that I'm doing what I'm doing. My hat's off to pastors everywhere, because it is a huge responsibility!
http://acts17verse28.blogspot.com/
Because if the Pastor did introduce you to the God of the universe, there's no way you would leave.
But that's probably a bit too harsh.
Yet these were also problems with the church in Corinth, were they not? And yet Paul did not question their salvation nor call for an upheaval of the church nor turn his back on the wayward body.
The problem, then, with people leaving the church today seems to be that consumerism has so thoroughly permeated the mindset of today's Christian. We are too lazy, too fat, too stupid to stand beside Paul in working through struggles toward unity for the glory of Christ; rather, if the pastor says something we don't like, we leave. If the church isn't meeting our needs (which, after all, is the whole reason the church is supposed to exist, right?! /sarcasm), we find a church with the right programs that WILL meet our needs. We will jump ship if the preacher is too boring, or the music is too loud, or the social programs are not ambitious enough, or the paint in the sanctuary is too crazy, or the parking is too sparse... you get the picture.
I'm not saying the church doesn't have problems — it does and the time to meet those problems is now. I just want to be careful not to denigrate Christ's bride too much, when it might be that we ourselves are the problem, not "the church".
pcg,
i agree with your point/points wholeheartedly. the reality of the church's imperfection is very apparent to all of us. many people who left the church whom i've talked to seem to consider themselves very "spiritual" because they made the decision to leave the church or a particular congregation. yes we are stupid. the apostle paul could have just continued starting new congregations when the existing ones disappoint him. but, in his writings, he takes the time to present the truth of God, make efforts to reconcile himself to others and reconcile those that have been "disenfranchised". it's all about redemption. we all need to be saved.
we are the church. there is a place for constructive feedback to try to put things in perspective and order. but when it's all about criticism and not much love and grace and a continued striving for unity, then we are not attacking the church. we are attacking the Bridegroom too.
have a blessed day!
And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection. But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience. Luke 8:14-15
Acts chapter 2 the Holy Spirit fell on all in the Upper room at an appointed time. My point is that they were all gathered for one reason and they were in prayer. There was no one in the room who was not a true believer or a disciple of our Lord.
The Bible teaches as the coming of Christ draws closer it would be become beyond difficult to be a believer in this world and continue in the faith.
The Apostles were constantly encouraging the leaders and flock to hold fast to their faith and confession of Jesus Christ because they understood the hardship. How much more do we need that now?
Finally there was Demas of whom Paul finally said,
For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world, and is departed unto Thessalonica; Crescens to Galatia, Titus unto Dalmatia. Only Luke is with me. Take Mark, and bring him with thee: for he is profitable to me for the ministry. 2 Timothy 4:10-11
In the end all who should be in the house will be there. I have very few I can fellowship with outside of a church building because over the years I have found less who love the Word of God and find their joy in the Holy Ghost.
A pastor's wife discipled me after I became a believer. One of the best words of glory she could have given me was to direct me to Psalm 119. It took me three years or longer to finally act on her words and read it.
By the time I read it the Lord had already told me how to walk with Him and it agreed with Psalm 119. It was the Word of God.
I don't see how there can be so many Bibles today and still many people are no closer to Jesus than when we had fewer versions. But I believe there needs to be a serious revival of God's Word in our churches and in our hearts. You cannot always hope to have others around to keep you rooted and grounded.
After 31 years of walking with th Lord I would rather gather with one or two who love Jesus, are baptized with His Spirit and love the Word of God than spend time in a church building with all the doubt and unbelief listed in the graph above.